How far are we away from being a top-six side?

Would Hoilett help us become an established top-six side?
Now before you go all crazy and tell me that we’re in the top six currently I’d like to clarify two things.

1 – I’m aware of our league position.

2 – I want to discuss how far you think we are away from being a regular top-six side.

Should we finish in the top-six this season, it doesn’t automatically make us a top-six in the long term. For that to be the case we need to finish there for a few seasons so we can be considered a consolidated top-six team in the sense that we are tipped to finish up there at the start of the season. Essentially there is nothing to say that this season is just a flash in the oan, but I guess we’ll only find out next season…

It was a question raised by Pootle in a comment the other day. Basically he asked how many players everyone thought we were away from being in a position to regularly finish in the top-six, and it was a bloody good question to be fair so I thought I’d make an article out if it.

Pretty much everyone knows that our squad has limitations. Even Alan Pardew said as much the other day. To boost our ability our squad as whole still needs a lot of work done to it and it is very much still a project in working with the next stage set to be competed in the summer.

So where would you go? What positions would you sign? How much do we need strengthening? By splitting it up and drilling down into different positions I hope to come up with my own answer in this article and leave you to come up with your own afterwards.

For arguments sake I’m going to assume that none of our first team players leave or, if they do, I’m going to assume that they are replaced like for like so if well sell a midfielder I expect to see him replaced with….. a midfielder. Basically think of the first XI as it is now, and then work the squad out from that.

Goalkeeper

I actually think this is one position where we are fine. Tim Krul is proving to be one of the best on the league and isn’t exactly a sicknote so we should be fine between the sticks. Should Timmy pick up an injury I’ll be concerned as we will likely only have Rob Elliot as backup come the summer with Fraser Forster and Steve Harper heading out of the club, but I don’t think it is a priority.

Defence

Where do we start with this? I believe we need to do some major defensive work in the summer to give us much needed depth and quality. Naturally we’ll have Steven Taylor back, but his injury history isn’t good and he tends to have one long term injury each season. With that in mind we need one centre-back that can challenge the starting line up, unlike an Adrian Mariappa for example. That would give us four central defenders, or five if we sign another one as backup.

In terms of the right/left back, I think Davide Santon is learning quickly and will become a cracking player for us, but I’d like to see him on the right. With that in mind we’ll need a dedicated left-back signed in the summer. Ideally we’d keep Danny Simpson around as he could provide cover and competition for those in the first team, and with Santon and Ryan Taylor able to play on the right or left it gives us some flexibility and depth to the squad.

Midfield

I actually think we’re about fine in midfield. Centrally we have Yohan Cabaye and Cheik Tiote as starters, with Danny Guthrie, Dan Gosling, Mehdi Abeid and James Perch able to give us cover. If Guthrie goes we’ll need someone to slot into his place of course.

On the left wing I don’t think we’re too bad in truth. Jonas Gutierrez has been poor of late, but it has to be noted that he hasn’t got any competition currently and he tends to up his game suddenly when he has someone snapping at his heels wanting to get into the team. With Sylvain Marveaux and Hatem Ben Arfa able to play on the left we have that competition so the performances and squad depth should see a marked improvement on the left.

On the right we have Gabriel Obertan, Hatem Ben Arfa and Ryan Taylor to ponder. All of them have their merits and pitfalls and as yet I’m unconvinced as to who is our best option the right. Obertan’s pace is deadly, but a lack of killer instinct holds him back. Hatem Ben Arfa can produce moments of magic in attack, but he’ll also leave the right-back hopelessly exposed and Ryan Taylor gives us a threat from set pieces and crosses but doesn’t have much pace. If you could combine all three you’d have the perfect winger but right now we have to do with horse for courses.

Personally this is somewhere where I’d like to see us improve by signing someone like Junior Hoilett who can do pretty much everything a winger needs to do and has pace to burn. That one signing would give us so much depth on both wings and would pretty much sort us.

Striker

In attack we are still lightweight. Beyond Demba Ba and Papiss Cisse we don’t have an awful lot to think about, which is worrying when you consider we’ll more than likely be losing both of them to the African Cup of Nations again next year.

Once again it’s an area that needs strengthening, but it will require careful strengthening. For instance I really can’t see many strikers getting ahead of those two, so we need to have a look at strikers who will happily play backup and wait for a chance. The problem is that any striker who has a reputation for scoring goals will more than likely warrant a starting place elsewhere.

So what are we looking for? I make it, as a minimum, one right or left back, one centre back, one right winger and another striker, and remember, that is without losing any of our first teamers or assuming that we replace them with like for like replacements.

What do you think we need though?

About toonsy

A lifelong Newcastle fan and current webmaster of this very 'blog who has the sole aim of creating a place by Newcastle United fans, for Newcastle United fans.

169 thoughts on “How far are we away from being a top-six side?

  1. @oblong

    Good to see you post . You should do so more often. The more the merrier. 😉

    @dwayne

    You say;
    but don’t shoot the messenger tho

    Cheeses wept ! It was like the wacky races after I called the Tiote and Krul exodus wrong.
    Catch the pigeon . Catch the pigeon. You were like **** Dastardly . 😛

    I’m gonna rip it out of you messenger boy if you are wrong. 🙂

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  2. Agree with those who say we need 5 or 6 players in but i do think we need a decent 2nd choice keeper as well dont think much of elliot ,and a none african striker 😉

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  3. Were a few players away from having a quality side but also a couple of injuries away from a crisis.

    If it wasnt for Saylors injury and Tiote being unavailable for a huge chunk of the season i reckon we would be sitting 4th with a bit of a cushion… 🙁

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  4. @CC

    Other clubs lost players to the ACoN . Drogba and a few others I’m sure.

    We can’t complain where we are.

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  5. Bats, just took you up on yer treble recommendation, well, over 2.5 on each (think that’s what you meant) – got about 7/1 on it. Only stuck 7 quid on it, so I won’t be rund yer hoos with mi crack beaver commandos if it doesn’t come off 😉

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  6. i think as a back up striker i would look at fletcher from wolves not a great player by any means but a lot better than shola ect and think he would be happy to sit on bench at a bigger club no idea of his age ect ime with BATTY on elliott saw him play couple of times on tv with his last club and odd one at toon dont rate him one bit will never be up to epl standard imo

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  7. Just catching up with the blog from yesterday. Funny as fook!

    Never in all my life have I seen anyone as comprehensively OWNED as Pootle was by Stardust!! 😆 😆

    I can’t believe Pootle felt so intellectually threatened he actually posted his IQ score!! 😆 😆 😆

    Reet – am off oot to enjoy the day. Some of you neggers should try it some time – you never know – you might like it! 😉

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  8. We are still a club very much in transition and it will take a bit more time to get in the required quality to offset any quality that has to play in tournaments and such to ensure we don’t suffer.
    It’s only naturally we will struggle with a key midfield out, through a ban ,(Cabaye) and Tiote ,(ACON) as well as losing your main striker (Ba) to the same ACON.
    The fact is though, we toughed it out and managed to get through it without getting a new hole ripped in the main.

    It’s only natural we are gonna get one stuck up us against the odd team here and there and it happens to the best of them.

    The main thing is, we are carefully, albeit slowly assembling a squad that are producing the main ingredient needed and that is a full on fighting mentality and a never say die attitude.

    There’s a lot to be said on properly vetting players so they fit into a system and in the main we are getting it spot on, so a few tweaks here and there and we move one step forward once again and so on.

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  9. 25 players have left brum since last season and their still in the promotion shake up and doing well in the cups, Chris showing again what he can do with his hands tied behind his back and yet again brucie is in line for another premier league club with his previous… 🙄

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  10. We need a centre back to replace staylor/willo who are essentially on the same level. Possibly someone who can cover across the back four as a replacement right back/left back cover would be nice, seing as Simmo will be off it seems.

    Need a new winger-especially if Arfa isn’t going to be getting regular time on the wing. Marv will hopefully be back and Jonas/Obertan can cover or do a job in the defensive matches.

    Need a new forward…A youth striker would be nice…and not african please!

    Essentially, Krul, Colo/Cabaye/Tiote/Ba are top 6 quality.

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  11. A couple of defenders are essential. Replacements for Smith and Lovenkrands as well. And a goalkeeper if Harper leaves.

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  12. Defence is priority! Midfield looks good bar our wingers still leave alot to be desired. in attack we need need someone, perhaps young one, to be 3rd choice and be able to step up during acon. So defo a quality cb( vertonghen – yes pls ), new quality full back(prefer a lb then move santon to rb.), young striker( eg jay rodriguez ). And if possible look to upgrade our wings.

    I think an upgrade in defence would see us a long way to become a consistent top-6.

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  13. Great to see the poisonous Headless Chicken try and stir things up. He’s there every time without fail.

    Pootle

    Don’t rise to him, he will go running to Toonsy if you do.

    Move on Chicken and stop stirring, cos you only complain when they reply.

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  14. Just having a debate with my mate.

    Who do you rate the best . Woodgate in his prime or Colo in his prime.

    And why?

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  15. Chris Hughton is doing great with that team. Played already 42games,about 25players left,thin squad. Still doing well. 😯

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  16. Think Woodgate cuod have been one of the best if he stayed injury free. For that reason it has to be Colo.

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  17. Toonsy. Good balanced article. Wouldn’t disagree with any of it. Defence must be the priority though and less hoof ball.

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  18. Woodgate would edge it for me because he was nigh on perfect, Colos lack or pace and height sometimes gets exploited where woodgates only weakness was his fitness…

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  19. @Toonsy

    My views are that Woodys timing and positional play are the best I’ve ever seen of any English CB but Colo does things that Woody couldn’t.
    As a ball player and close control I put Colo ahead in that department.

    But overall, woody edged it .

    My mate reckons Woody was streets ahead.

    Anyone else folks? Opinions?

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  20. Well its nice to inspire an article instead of an argument for a change 😳 :mrgreen:

    I think to be considered regular challengers (and to have any hope of being competitive in Europe too) we need a minimum of:
    FB- agree with you Toonsy, Santon on the right ideally and. Pieters type left back who can play centreback also brought in.

    CB- not a back up, someone to challenge the excellent Taylor and Colo.

    LW and RW – I’m not convinced by any of our options to be honest. Obertan and Ben Arfa may step up to the plate by next season but if they don’t we’ll have no wide players who are good enough at providing crosses and assists.

    CDM- for when Tiote is out. I don’t think the competition would do him any harm and it would be nice to have 2 CDM’s for tactical flexibility too.

    ST- we need more depth but i don’t think we need to spend big here. We should scour the championship and foreign leagues for up and coming youngsters, as provided they are fit and don’t get sold the Dembas are going to be difficult to dislodge.

    I think this is the minimum we need to instantly make our squad strong enough to be considered a regular top prospect.
    The wingers may be less neccessary if we use formations that don’t need wide midfielders, but in that case we will probably need a quality AMF and quality ST/FW instead.

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  21. Toon U18 salvaged a draw against mackem U18. 2-2 is final score and apparently we played last 18 mins with only 10.

    And regarding Cisse, the friendly is on Wednesday 29th and he should back for m5ck1m league game on Sunday. 😀

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  22. It’s ok Troy. I don’t feel threatened by anyone on here.
    I had an epiphany yesterday.
    I woke up and read the Wielding the Axe article and saw the attempt to derail it when it was only 10 posts long.
    I read Prem’s comments about it and to be honest I had to agree. Toonsy has talked about this before but it was this one that opened my eyes, I guess.
    I thought that the person who put the effort into writing it must sometimes get pretty pissed off to see people just **** all over their work with pointless willy-waving.
    I had tried posting a response in a previous thread to be less disruptive but the other party continued to repetitively drag the same old **** through thread after thread.
    At this point I decided enough was enough. I don’t want to be responsible for people getting sick of writing for the site.

    I could get into insult-a-thons, I could get into pointless ‘my dad is bigger than your dad’ style arguments and I could easily carry an argument on for a lifetime.
    But I happen to agree with Toonsy, its not good for the site, it devalued the work people put into the articles and it will drive people away.
    “So for that reason, I’m out”

    Wel,l I’m just going to ignore the trolls anyway :mrgreen:

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  23. @pootle

    Fair do’s. 😉

    Try answering my Colo / Woody debate so I can settle a point with a mate.

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  24. Agree with Pootle on this one – 1 or 2 CDM’s absolutely essential. Our midfield, bless ’em, is hopelessly lightweight at times and far too pushy as a unit. Good players, don’t get me wrong, but as a section it is weak, and when Tiote goes, it all goes – that’s not an acceptable situation. Pretty much everyone agrees the defence needs backup and we can’t cross a ball into the box for love nor money so I think the time of Jonas and Obertan may be drawing to a close, sadly. HBA looks like he will then remain an impact sub, tactical game-changer which may not be to his liking.

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  25. I dunno. Problem is most of my memories of Woodgate are of him being a talented crock. Bags of potential and good reading of the game but never fulfilled due to injury.
    Colo I think may be just starting to reach what will be his best.
    He seems to be more a mixture of defender and midfielder and it can be very exciting watching a defender who’d comfortable taking the ball forward.
    Remember Albert. When he made a defensively poor decision he could redeem it by going on a run and setting up a goal or executing a perfect chip.

    Hmmm, that hasn’t really cleared it up. Lol.

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  26. Troy – From all practical angles, I think you might have to put aside technical abilities in view of ability to stay fit and uninjured. In that case, Colo wins.

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  27. Troy,
    Woodgate shades it for me, he is the best CB i have ever seen at the club.
    I remember the night at home against Marseille when he had Drogba in his pocket. He was that good that he made Titus look a decent player when they played together.
    Woody had presence/strength and postional sense as well as pace.
    Colo lacks a bit of pace and sometimes strength, that is why Woody shades it 😉

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  28. @TGS

    It was Andy Ross (know him ?).

    I’m with you. To say Woody was streets ahead is extreme to say the least tho that’s his view.

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  29. I remember Troy saying he was leaving the blog n not coming back….how come he’s back?

    Were you not serious Troy?

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  30. I reckon we need a left winger who has lots of pace and who doesn’t hesitate to put a decent cross into the box. In terms of right wingers I think we’re fine! Obertoon is gonna be a class act once he’s got a few more league games under his belt. Ryan Taylor offers good cover there for when we need a more defensive strategy. With HBA and Leon Best in cover up front we’ll be sound. So the only other position I’d say is centreback. We could do with a class CB to play alongside Colo and a younger prospect for backup in the same position too as well as a new TH who can show Simspon how its done

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  31. Troy is 100% correct in my opinion. Woodgate was exceptional at being in the right place and often making crucial tackles, yet he couldn’t touch Colo in terms of composure and technical ability on the ball. For those reasons alone, Colo gets my vote.

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  32. I think we are 4 quality players short of having a top six squad ,our first 11 are top six but as the absentees (Tiote , Cabaye Taylor) of the last few games have proved we have no real strength in depth against the big teams . 2 quality defenders , a specialist CB and a specialist LB and no more utility players ,we already have enough of them .Plus a box to box midfielder and another striker and we will move into a regular top six spot . I can see another clear out of deadwood happening in the summer with Smith , Harper and Lovenkrands being first out of the door but it would not surprise me if Ben Arfa , Gosling and Shola were shifted as well . That is a fair amount of wages off the books and i do have a feeling that if we finish top 6 then the new signings will be more quality and less quantity .

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  33. @wolfie @79

    Nobody has seen much of Elliot unless they saw the two seasons he played for Charlton in the lower divisons, b4 that he was shipped here there and newhere.

    We desperately need another Keeper, I’d just tell Forster hes gannin nowhere.

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  34. I see Perch and Raylor being pushed down the order and out the door soon too. maybe the same with Simmo and Guthrie, who are OK but are 2nd tier in the way the side is shaping up currently, unfortunately. HBA and Obertan may well move on as their faces may not fit at all in the summer, depending on the way the signings go. Did everyone forget Xisco, the made-of-steel goal-machine?

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  35. @Troy

    I’d say Woodgate, In his day he was a world beater. As Real Madrid found out. Although I think Colo is superb I’m not sure if he could reach Woodgates ability. But good question, it’s a tough un. 😕

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  36. I was talking with a German soccer fan yesterday and he said our Cisse is a striker that thrives on good service and will score heaps of goals if we just give him a supply line.

    So… who’s our supplier?

    It feels like the team has really lacked that final pass deliverer. Ba can score from almost nothing but I don’t know if Cisse is that kind of player.

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  37. If we are to climb the table I would like us to get rid of Best, Loven, Ranger and Shola. 4 players that arent going to pull up trees. Replace them with decent players you could rely on. At a push I’d keep Best..

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  38. Our top assists providers are Shola and Raylor with just 3 each. After them, Best, Ben Arfa, Cabaye and Jonas with just two each. To me, this says we don’t really have a focused supply route–it’s kind all over. Is that good?

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  39. @TGS

    He wears special items of clothing with a pillow stitched in his t-shirts.

    He can’t wear jeans with his pillow lined t-shirts do wears elasticated slacks.

    I was out with him the other week for a pint and he turned up looking like La La from the teletubbies.

    😆

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  40. fans etc – it’s good in a way but not enough. Jonas & HBA should be positioned to assist much more as I see it.

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  41. Yeah, I’ve been looking at these and, sorry to go overboard, but compared with the other “top” teams, we’re sorely lacking.

    City’s Assists:

    David Silva 12
    Samir Nasri 7
    Sergio Agüero 5
    James Milner 5
    Micah Richards 5
    Yaya Touré 4

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  42. mackems commence getting humped by Arsenal soon. do hope so we could do with them being tenderised prior to their pummeling at SJP. Really looking forward to being there for that one now, keep forgetting the Wolves game in between! 😆 😆 😆

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  43. @JJ

    the question wasnt for the Toon, it was in his prime.

    ….Who do you rate the best . Woodgate in his prime or Colo in his prime.
    And why?

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  44. Anyone noticed that the bairns came back from 2 down with 10 men against the unwashed jnrs? Does the fighting spirit come down the ranks or start with them, I wonder?

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  45. Troy as good as Colo is I would say Woody would shade it for me, colo is far more comfortable with the ball, but for everything else Woody has it. Injury was the only thing that stopped Woody from being one of the top defenders in the world.
    Could you imagine having the 2 in the same side 😯

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  46. Sunderland V Arsenal soon!!

    although u could probably guarantee the unwashed will win…

    not sure if I can bring myself to watch it… 😯

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  47. Mark,
    Hmmm, very hard. It’s like comparing Shearer in his prime to Owen in his prime. They are very different players.
    In fact I think they’d have been a perfect partnership.

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  48. @Big Dave

    aye, defo m8. Woody was sensational.

    but give me Tony Adams anyday 😯 😉

    That Kompany is the closest I have seen to Woody in the prem over the last few yrs. he’s looked good everytime I’ve saw him.

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  49. I fancy the Wenger boys still, they are due a surge. Injury- proof Woody & Colo in the same side? Most teams wouldn’t even bother to crank the bus up. I saw Woody in a precious few games and he absolutely owned his man with ease at times. I remember some tackles where I still can’t work out how he reached the ball, and he had a way of striding away from danger that was demoralising for the guy pressuring him. Colo does that as well mind, and he can even do tricks on the oppo byline when he wants to – top that!

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  50. Maybe gonna get banned for this but i hope the unwashed beat Arsenal . If they do then i can see it having a bad knock on effect for the rest of the season for Arsenal . They won’t have much else to play for and i can see their best players giving up and walking in the summer . Would be good for our chances of top six .

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  51. @JJ In fact I think they’d have been a perfect partnership….

    aye that would of been some partnership like 😎

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  52. Axel – I can see what you’re thinking but defend could also galvanise Arsenals push for the top four for the CL spot when the cup is no longer an option. On the other hand if the soap-free hordes taste defeat they may bounce back against us for the same reason – Europa may be a feasibility if they continue in form. I have just had a terrible thought – what if…

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  53. Mark Tony was good but I just never liked him 😕
    As for Kompany im near sure we were linked with him a few yr ago, he is a cracker.
    JJ they would have made some strike partnership 😯

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