Granted all of those players are Geordies (or adopted Geordies in Taylor’s case), but I’m not really referring to the geography of where they were born. What I’m referring to instead is the number of players who have come through the ranks at NUFC and have managed to find a way into the first team.
Players who have made the jump have been in short supply over the years. We’ve had a handful of players who have really flourished, before heading off to pastures new, and we’ve had players who have stumbled into the first team, before heading off to pastures new. The only exception I guess is Steven Taylor…
Maybe it’s something to do with loyalty in the modern game? There isn’t an awful lot of it going about in all honesty, and that works both ways between club and player. Both can be as loyal as they want or as fickle as they want which means that it’s not too often these days that you’ll see a player stay at one club for very long. It’s not often you’ll see a player burst onto the scene these days either…
Which brings me back on point after going off on a tangent. I look at the current crop of the next generation of NUFC players and I see very little to get excited about. Granted we have some good players in prospect, with the likes of Haris Vuckic, Mehdi Abeid, Shane Ferguson and so on being talked about positively, but sooner or later they have to make the leap from being a prospect to being a fixture in the first team, and I just can’t see a way that is going to happen.
Every so often you get a player that comes along, a Gazza, a Pedro, a one-off, that you can just tell will make it and who find themselves thrust into first team action at a very early age – think Wayne Rooney. The rest of them though have a long race to run, and the fact of the matter is that the race is often too long for some and they end up drifting into obscurity.
The fact is that football is a results based game and a sequence of poor ones will see a manager out of a job before too long. This is where the conflict between the now and the future exists. Young players have to learn and they can only do that by playing in games, which will generally make the team a little bit weaker to start with as they learn the ropes. The long term benefits to it could be great, but when a game is lost the focus is not too often on the longer term and there is pressure to change something.
To me this is one of the biggest problems we have in our game right now, both at NUFC and beyond. There is this clamour to play the best team at all times, for the now, even if it means forgetting the future just a bit. In turn that means younger, highly-rated, players end up stagnating by playing football at a lower level.
This is my concern right now as we focus on building the development side of things up. It’s all well and good doing that, but will those players ever get the chance to shine through?
Looking at the way things have gone thus far, probably not!
Fair points there Toonsy…. Krul has come through the youth ranks as well hasn’t he?..
I see we down to 9th in the PL table there.. It is disapointing to see we have slipped from 5th so quickly 😯 Cabaye must be playing too deep again 😎
Aussie Magpie Fan(Quote)
I agree, that’s why we need to be loaning out promising youngsters to get first team football, gradually progressing through the different leagues. Eg loan Campbell to Gateshead for six months, reserves for three months, Northampton for six months, reserves for three months, Hartlepool/Carlisle for six months, going between reserves and our bench for three months, loan to Huddersfield/Middlesbrough for six months, sub appearances and cup games for three months, loan to a lower table PL side six-twelve months, first team player. By the time he’s a first team player he’ll be 20/21 and will have experienced every league and if he was good enough in each of them he’s proved he’s as promising as was said, and is ready to start, this is how Barca operated with Messi and the rest of their youngsters.
Andymag(Quote)
i think Taylor is the only 1 with real geordie blood in him ,the other 3 couldnt fck off quick enough 😈 😈
batty(Quote)
We have 3 players that are out of the acadmey which I would consider first team players , Krul Saylor and Shola ( love him or hate him ) and we have similar number that I would consider squad players , Fergie Sammi and Vuckic ( I might be a little generous with Vuckic ). Its not too bad of a record but I think we need to improve on this area and I think we are going to see a decent investment on players coming into the youth team trying to break into 1st team squad over the summer.
Johno Toon(Quote)
Andy – decent points made there. It is a real problem. I expected either Vuckic or Abeid or both to get 5 -10 first team appearances last season. That’s the way it had to be if they were going to progress and develop properly. However, when every game, every point is so **** important now it’s killing that process. When I was younger it mattered little to me whether we finished 7th or 17th. It just didn’t mean much. We hadn’t won the bloody thing and only 1 or 2 teams got euro football. When we finished 2nd in 96 we only got EL FFS!
I agree loans seem to be the only way but it’s got to be to a good team with a promise of starts.
georgio(Quote)
I don’t think in this respect we fair much worse than most clubs, maybe even better than most. I posted a quote from an article the other day sying that of 600 16 year olds at Premier league academies, less than 100 were still in the professional game at “any” level by the age of 21,…..and out of those 100 ish there’ll have been very few still plying their trade in the Prem, sad but true 😕
richietoon(Quote)
I think the club have made it clear that that’s their intention haven’t they.
I completely agree with it as well, it’s great seeing young uns come through the ranks. They don’t have to be super stars like Gazza or Pedro, the likes of Watson, Howey or Clarky would be welcomed aswell. I think we have afew at the moment that are on the cusp like Fergie, Haris and Sammi who can look at the likes of Krul and Taylor and see that if they work hard can get into the first team.
I agree with Andy as well though, we have players like Campbell and Hooper coming through who need to be challenged more. Playing youth or reserve team football isn’t competitive enough for their development in my opinion and we should be working with local teams like Gateshead and Darlington to loan out some of our promising young players.
That should give them decent players for nowt for the season, develop the player but also allow them to see lower league football, so they hopefully understand just how big an opportunity they have at Newcastle.
Sharpy17(Quote)
Sammys born and bred aint he, Good feet at times and a sweetish left peg.
I think he will be good given time, He looked better on the left of a front three for the u21s last year, Maybe he could play there when Ba joins spurs and chelsea next month… 🙄
CC(Quote)
CC – not sure meself about Sammi. He might make it but getting past HBA/Marv and whoever comes in is quite an ask. Loan for Sammi?
Like the idea of Ba’s left leg at Spurs and the right at Chelsea. At only £7m what do they expect?
georgio(Quote)
Off topic – I know it may be paper talk again but The Peope are suggesting today that we are playing hard ball in the negotiation for Clyne.
Seemingly Palace want £3m up from with up to £2m add ons – we only want to pay £2m and no add ons ( according to the papers).
It worries me a bit that we want top dollar for our players but want all or our signings at knock down prices. Don’t get me wrong, I know we want the best deal possible, but like us, Palace balance their books by player sales as do other clubs we deal with, but I don’t like the idea of taking the ****.
It seems they don’t want to offer Simmo a contract, but I’m sure if they sell him they will want a good price but want his replacement for peanuts. I know it’s a difficult balance but I think we need to be a bit more negotiable at times.
Sharpy17(Quote)
georgio
Aye he will struggle to get past them for league matches but maybe in the uefa next season will give sammi, vuckic, fergie, abeid etc. a crack at decent enough opposition.
On Ba i really am getting sick of hearing it now, If he wants away then get rid and let us replace him while Gameiro and De Jong are up for grabs, Same with Simpson if we miss out on Clyne or Debuchy and then he decides to leave then we are scraping around for ****…
CC(Quote)
Sharpy @ 10 I disagree , I think the club needs to make their valuation of a player and try and stick to it as much as they can. We probally do have a growing reputation of been tight basterds but I think that is a good thing.
Johno Toon(Quote)
Giorgio@9, that would be an interesting spectacle when Chelsea and Spurs came to play each other. Would that make it easier for him to score or harder though? I reckon he’d just spin around on the centre spot, and eventually drill through the earth’s core and end up playing for Melbourne Heart. Although he’d probably just explode.
…on next generation players at the Toon, this guy is definitely one for the future:
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/138/32719399.jpg/
😛
Rodzilla(Quote)
JT – wouldn’t disagree, I’d hate to see us paying over the odds. What I’m saying though is that initial valuation has to be alittle more realistic, particularly with younger players they are looking to sign.
I suppose what I mean is, playing hard ball with clubs like Liverpool and Chelsea is one thing, but clubs like Palace and Coventry survive off player sales. Yes stick to an initial fee then use things like add ons for numbers of appearances and International call ups, or things like sell on payments or even offering some of our players to them on loan or something. I just mean that they shouldn’t take a tough stance on ever player or we will loose out to teams we are hoping to compete with.
Sharpy17(Quote)
But Beardsley wasnt a youth product was he, unless we’re counting Wallsend BC ? We got him from Vancouver Whitecaps didnt we?
Rothervalleymag(Quote)
I dunno sharpy if we value a player at X i dont think we should go over that becasue the club in question needs it to survive. Or maybe Im just a mean person 🙂
In the broader aspect of football , clubs need to get their house’s in order as I read today that Premierleague clubs wage to income ratio is 70%. That is becoming dangerously close to unsustainable I know alot of that is down to City and Chelsea but all clubs need to be careful of these pitfalls.
Johno Toon(Quote)
Rother…Technically he didn’t work his way through the ranks, but he was on Newcastle’s books before being released and picked up by Carlisle….I think!
richietoon(Quote)
We are finding plenty of players from abroad who have come through the ranks and made it though. Not so much the modern game to blame here, but the **** poor emphasis we in England have on grass roots and development. The FA have been talking **** about finding a solution for this fir a giod 15 years but always fall short due to financial incentives from TV etc to maintain the Prem as the ‘best in the world’ – hence such a lack of local kids getting a shot. Disgusting really and Trevir Brooking should be sacked fir achieving fook all. The 4 wise men me ****, they have not improved anything on that front and not got us anywhere near a major trophy on the International stage either. Useless.
Shamrock(Quote)
Is it actually true that perch has been called up for England? Seems to ridiculous.
Andymag(Quote)
Yeah I’ve said for a while now that the whole “youth development” scheme is a nice idea but in practice unless you’re going to spunk millions on prospects and have a world class bunch of coaches/facilities to train them up with then you’re pretty much relying on pot luck. Fergie, Sammeobi, Vuckic, Abeid, they have a chance of making it in the prem. But with us? If we’re aiming for champions league, can we afford to carry youngsters for a while during an important league campaign? Not really…..this is why Europe will be handy this season, give a bunch of them starting spots and lets see how they do.
Newkie(Quote)
JT – I’m not saying we should offer more because the club needs to survive but because a different club is interested. For example Man Utd with Clyne or Debuchy. I sometimes get the feeling that the quibble on over a relatively small increase in what we would be prepared to offer which results in either pissing the selling club off who break off negotiations, or allows another club time to come in and beat us to the signing.
Using Clyne as an example, were happy to offer £2m but Palace want £3m and then up to £2m on add ons. So we are fannying on over £1m up front, then say to them £1m add ons and here’s Ranger or Tav for the season.
Man Utd seem to be able to come to an agreement with teams, where we say that’s our offer take it or leave it as though we hold the cards. I just think well loose more transfer targets than sign with that sort of attitude.
Sharpy17(Quote)
Sharpy – good point mate. The club, MA/DL that is, seem to have a very hard business line. It’s not nice, it’s not friendly but judging by what happened last season, it works. I, like you, don’t particularly like it and definitely don’t like them but there is something admirable in it. This is the deal – take it or leave it and we pay cash up front.
Rod – maybe all that drilling would put his knee right! Mind you some of the things we’re hearing about him and his band of agents, the explosion option sounds interesting.
georgio(Quote)
Sharpy@21- I think you make some good points there ,but one thing I think we need to also take into consideration is personalities involved. There is no doubting the fact that MA gets up the noses of most clubs we negotiate with ,due to our hard ball tactics over negotiations. To that end I feel some clubs will ask silly money off us now to prove a point as they either won’t back down and dislike MA so much they will break off talks and choose another club to do business with. Wigan chairman Whelan is a classic example of this asking £9m for n’zogbia when we tried to buy him back . It’s a balancing act and you need to treat clubs with some degree of respect I feel.
JohnoToon@16 You are right about the disparity of income to wages ,it’s a worry ,thankfully Toon appear to be addressing that issue. I was watching a report on sky sports news this morning and the PL grosses the most income from all the top leagues and yet the German BL is better of income wise by 3 times our total due to a more sensible approach on how clubs are run.Those **** efficient Germans again . 😉 . In Spain income is in complete turmoil and the corruption and fixing problems in Italy have led to senior figures in the game there to suggest cancelling all football matches for 2 years!!!.The dutch and French leagues are all desperately playing catch up with the PL with the French in particular falling away ,which is why so many French players are heading to u.k and Spain and Germany.
On topic Toonsy ,nice article and interesting questions raised. I ‘m not too concerned really as there will always be another Geordie hero come along ,for some reason Tyneside just seems to breed great footballers.Look all through the decades and it’s littered with great north east players .Theres always a new hero for every generation ,the secret is to nurture up and coming talent in the right way as addressed by Andy@2.
kimtoon(Quote)
i see bramble gets “off” dont beilive it
icedog(Quote)
Ice ,How many lives as that bloke got. 😯
kimtoon(Quote)
KIMTOON imo hes an animal,should have got ten mim,court of law ***,what money can do for some
icedog(Quote)
Kim – that’s exactly the point I’m try to make, I don’t think you can have this flatline of take it or leave it because even 100k will make so much more of a difference to clubs like Palace and Coventry compared to Liverpool and Chelsea. It may seem pennies to PL clubs but it could well be running cost for a lower division club. I think MA thought Watford were playing games over the Mariappa transfer with Wigan offering about £200k more than us. On that occasion I wasn’t overly disappointed to miss out on the player but there will be other players we go for from the lower leagues, like Clyne and the kid from Coventry and I’d hate the idea of loosing out on quality young players coz we refuse to budge or find a solution that benefits all parties – only for that player to be snapped up by a rival PL club who are prepare to be more flexible.
Sharpy17(Quote)
Ice, not the first time for Titus either. He got into trouble when he played for us too. That hotel in London, ‘roasting’ thing. Think it was him and his brother and Carlton Cole if I remember correctly.
Rodzilla(Quote)
ROD aye thats reet mate,i know he was found not guilty,but he was the talk of all the taxi lads,this lass was screaming in back of taxi he drove him to cop shop and he got nicked there and then,must think hes gods gift ffs
icedog(Quote)
yeah Ice, as you said, the law is an ***. It must have been more than a harmless fumble in the back of a taxi for the driver to take him straight to the cop shop. Poor show. I was expecting the judge to throw the book at him, given his previous. Got to feel sorry for the lass really, I.E. being the victim made out to look a liar. I don’t believe he’s innocent for one second.
Rodzilla(Quote)
ROD aye good point,so you are a thoughtful guy no matter what richie says lol
icedog(Quote)
I’m as sensitive as they come, me Ice. Richie is the only cold-hearted brute on here. 😛 …anyway, best get off before he punishes me, again.
Rodzilla(Quote)
🙂 😉
icedog(Quote)
Bramble being found not guilty is an absolute joke!!
Any sexual offence or rape case that gets as far through the judicial system as this did would suggest that there would have been a bucket load of evidence against him. It’s a disgrace footballers seem almost unconvictable. I know Ched Evans got jailed for his rape but his mate, the one who brought the girl into the hotel room in the first place, got off with it!!
I already know the outcome of John Terrys court case before the ****** even polishes his best shoes!!
Sharpy17(Quote)
SHARPY your reet its a bloody joke,things money can “buy”eh
icedog(Quote)
I can’t understand that jury verdict , for the taxi driver to be so concerned to drive straight to the cop shop ,he must of done something wrong . 😯
kimtoon(Quote)
We need to judge our ability to bring along youngsters by comparing to other squads in the Prem. I would say we are average in that respect. Now that Ashley is putting more money into building up the reserves (almost from scratch with the number of players let go) as well as the under 18’s mostly in the academy we should see significant improvement but I don’t expect to see the first 11 full of academy/reserve players at any point. At best 1 or 2 will make it every year or two but this allows us to let go of players such as Guthrie and possibly Simpson and Gosling as well. As long as the squad improves steadily we should do well. I still think the Arsenal approach of playing a lot of youngsters in cup matches is the way to go but they win often in the early rounds even with a young team whereas we don’t. That has to change and I think that is what Ashley is after.
GeordieTwo(Quote)
I have a feeling Adam Campbell could make it, but I can’t see any of the others do it even the likes of Sammi and Vuckic, I think they’ll have to move on.
As for Bramble as Ice said if you can afford the best Lawyers money can buy it gives you a real good chance of getting away with things.
Big Dave(Quote)
KIMTOON dont like to go on,women have the same “rights bullshit starting when?2nd class rights they mean, boils my water
icedog(Quote)
Ice – there are certain ladies who would happily take some of that money from him, in exchange for a price list for whenever he wanted to do a bit Brambling … got to be less hassle than all this alleged raping and fondling
Sharpy17(Quote)
SHARPY but its the same for both sexes is it not! nee footy got to blow off aboot sumit 😉
icedog(Quote)
Utd111 @123 on org
You’ve taken exception to a few things I’ve said re people on .org that were a ‘giggle’….although you seem okay I struggle to understand why you waste your time with ****** like AndyMac, Chuck or Worky.
witters(Quote)
Witters…In Utd111’s defence, that’s ‘cos you’re an annoying c@nt 😉 😆
richietoon(Quote)
WOW is .org still alive.
i would of thought ladyboy would of jaked by now..
hitman(Quote)
Richie…you’re right 😉 but I’m not biggest one
witters(Quote)
Witter’s…. 😆
richietoon(Quote)
Hitman…I always picture davros, king of the darleks, wonder if he’s Ian dowie?
witters(Quote)
remi streete is hotly tipped
Blackley & Brownlie(Quote)
B&B
Isn’t he a bit like Stevie T ie can’t stay on the pitch for a season without an injury.
Andymag(Quote)
Sharpy@40 Thing is with some folk it doesn’t matter how much money they have they still want things, what ever it may be for free. Having said that sexual assault is always about control and never really about sex imo . Anyway enough about him lets not waste anymore of our time on him ,with any luck divine intervention will crock him and finish his career . 😉
kimtoon(Quote)
Looks like Yann M’Vila is out for France. Just left the pitch in tears. If only they had a Jordan Henderson waiting in the wings like us hey 🙄 😛
Cabaye doing alright, a few good passes. Benny on the bench.
Jon R(Quote)
Kim – wonder how much control he would have had in the shower blocks? 😯 😥
Sharpy17(Quote)
SHARPY 🙂 🙂
icedog(Quote)
Lampard out of euros…that must open the door for the legendary Joey Barton…or next best, Paul Scholes…
Munich Mag(Quote)
MM…I wish, Henderson’s replaced him 😕
richietoon(Quote)
RT…aye Henderson is in….pity for Lampard like…. Pity we don’t have any good englishman among wor bunch of stars….
Munich Mag(Quote)
Hello, men (I assume).
Any players you’d consider here?
http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/blog/2012/may/31/released-players-life-lower-level
Fans Should Own The Club(Quote)
At this rate it will be mostly Dippers players representing England ,in which case we are defo fooked. 👿
kimtoon(Quote)
Kim/MM – as bad as Liverpool have played this season, they have 5 players of the 23 man squad???
Well done Woy, you’ve really shown yourself to be a complete mug!!!
Sharpy17(Quote)
Kim, it already is mate. 😐
Rodzilla(Quote)
…by that I meant they’re the highest concentration in the squad.
Rodzilla(Quote)
Sharpy17 it’s more a reflection of the dire gash state of English international football than anything the bin dippers are doing right. Cannot believe there is no place in the squad for Jamie Carragher…
Munich Mag(Quote)
Was that Bramble cleared of sex attacks, or Bramble cleared of six attacks ? 🙄 🙁
Munich Mag(Quote)
got nee time for english games couldnt give a ****
icedog(Quote)
MM – I don’t think things are THAT bad like, don’t get me wrong I don’t believe for a second we have a chance of winning owt. I know there have been injuries but I also think that there are better players who have been overlooked.
I’m not overly arsed about England but it’s still my national team and want to be able to get behind them, I wanted Pearce to get the job and bring the young uns through.
For some reason now though, I have the urge to support France … can’t really explain it?! 😕 😀
Sharpy17(Quote)
word up lads , soz aint been on here for a while … father duties 😆 , just watched france v serbia and they are going to be a force in the euros me thinks !!
Army69(Quote)
and lasses – sorry kim 😀
Army69(Quote)
I see we’re after Affeley again, 6m will get him apparently. Apart from his wages (80k), that would be a great buy, especially if Ba left, he could play LW, Cissé at CF and HBA at RW, that would be a formidable forward line.
Andymag(Quote)
Andymag, if that were actually a possibility in getting Affelay then that would be a deadly front 3!
Man, this summer is going to be full of bits like this isn’t it?! Hate it, and love it at the same time! 👿
AndrewT(Quote)
This is good…..
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1197774-newcastle-united-10-reasons-theyre-the-best-club-to-support-in-world-football
😎
Rodzilla(Quote)
ah, and apparently Santon is off now as well 😆
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2152933/Newcastle-face-fight-Davide-Santon-Roma-want-Nathaniel-Clyne.html
…with a bit of luck we might be in a 7 out 3 in situation. Wake me up when the Euros start.
ZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz…………..
Rodzilla(Quote)
Rodz
Was just about to post a link to that ‘bleacher report’ Newcastle fans thing myself, canny read and is nice to see that Arsenal fans praising comment.
Andymag(Quote)
The daily fail seem to have it in for us 😡
Andymag(Quote)
Danish papers suggest that we Will buy Dame N’Doye from FC Copenhagen for 4 mill£.
He has Been topscorer in The Danish league for three seasons in a row.
He reminds of Demba Ba, and is also plays for The national team with Cisse and Ba.
A very good back up in my mind.
See
Danishtoon(Quote)
DanishT…How accurate are the Danish papers? I don’t really want another striker who’ll be away in the ACoN 😕
richietoon(Quote)