They’ve found us out!

Players are ready to fight, says Tiote

Our scouting at its finest! After a few years of our scouting network working wonders unearthing low priced gems on the continent it seems that teams might now be wise to our scouting prowess.

If the media is to be believed it seems that in the last few days and weeks we have had bids for players rejected. I think this is a worrying trend that could jeopardise the transfer policy that has so far proved fruitful.

If we believe what the media prints, bids for Luuk de Jong, Vurnon Anita and Mathieu Debuchy have all been turned down recently and have resulted in Newcastle United being told to double and treble bids. Now I don’t claim to be an expert on any of the players aforementioned BUT I don’t think a midfielder playing in the Dutch league (albeit champions Ajax) is work more than maybe 5-6 million. The same applies with the other players, although I do think we have missed the boat with Debuchy because his value was always likely to increase after the Euros. De Jong again isn’t worth anywhere near the reported 15 million, and I honestly don’t think any team will pay over 10 for him. I think we should wait Twente out with him.

This new predicament has been waiting to happen for a while now. Teams will be simply waiting for bids from NUFC on their players and then using that bid as an estimation of worth. NUFC bid £4 million, the player must be worth £6 million and NUFC probably think the player is valued at £8 million. I think it is most worrying because it might mean that we will have to turn our attentions to much younger/cheaper players who we think might development in to stars of the future. It’s an increased gamble but one we might have to take. The other issue is that teams would’ve been monitoring our scouting/transfer progress closely and I have no doubt in some cases bidding against us just because our scouts think the player is worth buying.

Is scouting really this cloak and dagger? Maybe it is, maybe it isn’t, either way it might be a slower close season transfer wise for NUFC so patience will be needed.

About billquaymag

Im 26, im a geordie, i love the toon, i drink beer, im courting a staffnurse, i work as a slave to society....oh and i write on here....follow me on twitter @billquaymag

66 thoughts on “They’ve found us out!

  1. I don’t get it. What’s changed? Mikey won’t pay over the odds. Everyone knows that. Take it or leave it. Also it must be quite easy to put other clubs off the scent by dropping hints on other names.

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  2. There is nothing new here. Clubs always reflect initial bids. I feel sure that was the case with Tiote and Cabaye etc. We will make the signings we need and of course will not pay over the odds. Nobody is ‘wise’ to us. Its just football and we will be happy come August

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  3. If Carroll is worth 35 big ones the. De Jong is a bargain at £15m. £4m for a top international full back is taking the Mike. These are not players from ‘under the radar’ we are chasing, but top of the line talents. They do not relate to our previous excursions into the transfer market and should not be compared as such.

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  4. Agree with the other comments, I don’t think owt has changed. Go in with a bid if it gets rejected we either increase the offer if the club thinks the player is worth it, if not they move onto the next target.
    It’s the way football is, was and always will be.

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  5. De Jong again isn’t worth anywhere near the reported 15 million, and I honestly don’t think any team will pay over 10 for him. I think we should wait Twente out with him. lmao bud you write decent blog but you aint got a clue on a player is worth. 10 mil would be cheap in my opion and say hes worth more to twents figure than ours

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  6. Worrying over nothing if you ask me. Look at the last season where we were linked to all sorts of players but in the end didn’t splash out for them when we read the price tag: Gervinho, Erdinc, Pietrs.

    Just because we’ve had a £4 million bid for Debuchy rejected is no reason to start panicking: In case you hadn’t notice the Euros are on at the moment, most clubs aren’t going to start selling until that’s finished.

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  7. what i dont get is people saying other clubs will get our targets under our nose because we dont offer market value… this is crap ho… every team has a manager and they want their team to play in a style that suits his coaching idea… we can not go and buy players on trends, we are buying players to suit our style and i see it as counter attack…. looking at the trend of players we are getting we will only creater 2-3 clear chances per game and against good teams if we take them we win, but the most worring aspect is we have Carr and AP to do the job… why are we all worrin and stressin ourself…. here in carr and co we trust…. not all players we traget will play well for other clubs look at fulhm…ruz…. who!

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  8. Fact is, the London/Manchester press are apoplectic about Newcastle’s relative success, and will do ANYTHING to sabotage any chance of us continuing the trend. If you notice, their “Newcastle success wants to go to ****** club” has grown expansively. They are currently trying to get Ben Arfa and Cabaye to say they are off to THEIR clubs. With Ben Arfa it is based entirely on a pile of crap on a Liverpool supporters site, the scouse ars*hole just using past quotes from Ben Arfa and splicing them together and adding “big club” (meaning his own bunch of dinosaurs of course) which he never said. But the southern and Manchester press are DESPERATE to sabotage Newcastle’s surge of improvement.
    They are also trying to do the same to our transfer strategy, and get OUR targets for their own clubs – by outbidding of course. Saves their clubs scouts work if they can get Newcastle’s quality scout Graham Carr to do it for them.

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  9. @Toonarmyelite You’re forgetting one thing about De Jong, he only has one year remaining on his contract. £15 million is way over the odds. Remember Enrique last year, a player probably worth towards £15 million went for £6.5 million because clubs were not willing to pay that much with only one year remaining meaning we had to sell at a lower price.

    I honestly believe what we have offered (if we have actually offered a bid) is a good price for De Jong, if they don’t accept we should either push a little bit more (if the board think he’s worth it) or wait it out, Twente will probably get anxious the longer the window goes on and offer him on if no-one else bids, if they dont try again in January for around £6 million or sign a pre contract bosman ruling.

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  10. I think the club were spot on with their initial bids.
    I do not rate de Jong at all as a prem striker. 8 mil is his value IMO.
    The real gem is Guidetti. That lad looks to be the goods. Great motor, class and instincts.
    De Jong doesn’t have the physical or mental speed needed to be a top prem player. He’s more suited for Germany or maybe Italy.

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  11. There is undoubted jealousy towards Toon from the so called ‘big clubs ‘ in that we seem to have an eye for a good player on the cheap as it were .But the truth is the top clubs also have excellent scouting systems and good youth academys to provide top players for them .and in some cases the cash to get them too. I don’t think everyone is waiting on what we do /bid for and I also think we are a bit too cute business wise to be suckered like that as well. I can see us puttin g in low bids on players we would like but wouldn’t be crying over if we lost out on ,as our real targets are being worked on elsewhere . If we get them at low price great if not we have other targets ,Pards and co have already stated as much.

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  12. This is all based on what the papers say and as far as I can tell the papers are full of shit.. We are not the olny club starting off low and going from there.. Even City and Chelsea will start a few million lower than what they are prepared to pay with 30m+ bids 😕
    Remember Erdic, Gamero. Cissoko and the like from last season… Its all fun and games :mrgreen:

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  13. Kev @9- May be wrong but pretty sure from various sources that De Jong is contracted until June 2014. Meaning a price of £15m for someone of his age and talent is actually pretty decent compared to other deals in recent years… 😉

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  14. Seems bestie is off…. so as it stands no strikers when acon on if ameobi and nigeria qualify……. 😕

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  15. Liam @14 ,I’m sure we’ll get someone in ,it may not be De Jong but someone will arrive i’m sure. No way we would be daft enough to lose Best ,Lover and Ranger without backup arriving, well I sincerley hope not. 😉

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  16. There was always going to be competition for players like de Jong and Debuchy as they are good players who have a reputation which goes beyond our scouting network.

    Also never underestimate the role of agents in all this. I dare say they are putting some feelers out there looking for the best deal for the client and themselves.

    And as for ToonArmyElite saying:

    “lmao bud you write decent blog but you aint got a clue on a player is worth. 10 mil would be cheap in my opion and say hes worth more to twents figure than ours”

    Why does billquaymag not have a clue when expressing his opinion on what de Jong is worth yet your opinion must be taken as gospel?

    Righto 😕

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  17. Good article billy its true to certain extent 😉
    Think teams begin to realise if carr likes a player they good 😉

    Kim – as said other day guidetti might be good buy to replace best?

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  18. Good read Billy, a few of us said that we couldn’t keep pulling rabbits outta the hat, and in the end we would have to start paying proper money.
    As for other team waiting fir us to make a bid to know how much their player is worth 😯 im sure their club know how much their players are worth without us giving them an estimate. 😉

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  19. nice to see RICHIE back,good job me and aussie watched his back 😀 theres some back-stabbers aboot

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  20. HITMAN thats tough mate say you took some drugs by mistake thought they were painkillers,oot your heed worked for richie 😉

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  21. Liam @18 .Would they sell him to us though ,they seem to prefer loaning him out at present .I agree he looks very good and scoring lots last season.

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  22. The difference this year is that we are going for known commodities versus hidden gems it appears. This isn’t like finding tiote or even cabaye who no one really outside if france knew how good he was. Debuchy and de jong are known and rated by everyone. Plus because of recent successes clubs take notice now when we come in for a player

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  23. Report from Danish/swedish Press:

    John Gudetti are in talks with Newcastle United.
    A close source from sweden reports that Newcastle hope to Secure The transfer before The window opens.

    So maybe

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  24. Both De Jong and JG?

    JG can’t be that expensive and i Think Twente Will settle for 10 mill.

    My only concerns is still The defence.. We should go for one left and a cb

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  25. Danish @30 ,That sounds great ,hope it comes off as he scored 23 goals last season 😀 . There you go Liam ,looks like you may get your wish 😉

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  26. Kimtoon:
    Is everyone totally high on Debuchy??
    I really Think he is overrated and i Hope we Will target a more complete fullback cause Debuchy is weak defensive..

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  27. Danish @37 He certainly seems a talent going forward but I am yet to be convinced by his defensive strengths and look forward to how he does against the Spanish side. 😉

    Apparently Voetbalkrant site in Belgium reporting that Toon have had a £4m bid rejected for Toby Alderweireld. Not sure how reliable this is.

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  28. @37. I like debuchy but also worried that he isn’t very good at defineding. That’s problem when playing behind Ben Arfa. I’d take him but wouldn’t overspend for him.

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  29. MDS @39 Commentators on the France game the other night passed comment that ” that’s the first time we’ve seen Ben Arfa in front of Debuchy !”, that was around the 70 ish minute .Worrying 😯

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  30. Kim- that is worrisome. Who knows though, maybe he’s encoruaged to play that way. I hate to judge him solely off of the 2 matches I’ve seen.

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  31. MDS you could have a point,i think carr has watched him for over a year so maybe hes plays a bit diff for his club,surely we dont judge players on euro or world cup games many clubs have come un-stuck doing that in the past,ill trust carr but along with a few i worry about his defending 😕

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  32. Haven’t seen enough of Debuchy to judge if he’s good enough or not but what I have seen hasn’t been “amazing” from a defensive point of view, luckily not my job though, I’ll trust Pards, Carr and Co although I’d never judge any player you were going to sign for your club based on international performances as Ice says.

    Speaking of De Jong, my “source 🙄 ” who’s been as reliable in the past as Troy’s source says we’ve upped bid to 10m and deal will be completed shortly after window opens…..take with huge pinch of salt though as he’s not been great previously 😳

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  33. How do wanky sites like sportsvibe/clubcall get on news now ?? they cut and paste shite from the mirror like Arsenal wanting Ben Arfa which has no quotes or substance with them signing Podolski and Giroud and already having Van persie, walcott, chamberlain and gervinho.

    The most laughable thing is the ammount of gormless gullable cunts slobbering ower it and typing their approval… 🙄

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  34. ICE ,I’m reserving judgement a while longer as when Santon came he looked great going forward but not so hot defending but has come on leaps and bounds under Pards & co and it maybe they see the same in Debuchy. They obviously know they need attack minded fast defenders and we’ll just have to trust they can fine tune any frailities in a players defensive play.Ofcourse the whole Debuchy thing could be a hopefull punt on the clubs part and they really eyeing up someone else 😉 .

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  35. Ice 😀 I was thinking the same thing in regards to Richie. We have really watched his back whilst he has been away from this blog. He would certainly be hard pressed to find more loyal blokes than us to look after his interests 😯 😯 😆

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  36. Ice/Richie as you say I’ll trust Carr with him….

    It’s possible too that Pards puts more emphasis on a FB’s ability to bomb forward more so than their defensive abilities. Since he’s been here he tried hard to keep Enrique, he signed Santon, is interested in Debuchy, and isn’t looking to spend much to keep Simmo around. Simmo’s certainly the only defense-first player of that lot. Even Tavs, who Pards has said he really rates is supposedly an attack minded player who actualy played some as a winger last year on loan..

    I’m not a tactics expert by any means, but it seems to me an effective 4-3-3 needs these types FBs. Just a thought

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  37. I’m sure Debuchy will be a very competent defender with Cpt Colocinni keeping him right. He will also have a kick up the backside knowing there is Raylor and tav fighting for a place a RB, he has little competition at Lille and for France. Would love us to sign Guidetti if Best leaves, said he doesn’t want to be 5th choice at City, wonder if he’d be willing to be 3rd choice with us (2nd if you exclude Ba as he’ll be playing at LW kinda). And Alderweild would be a great signing as well as far as Ive heard he’s been one of the Erdevise’s best defenders.

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  38. Aussie…aye, with friends like you two… 😆

    Ice…Batty’s probably got a better record than my mate 😯

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  39. Speaking of De Jong, my “source ” who’s been as reliable in the past as Troy’s source says
    ————————

    So that’s to say your source has never benn right 😉

    @47. good point regarding Santon. Pards is also the only manager to ever make Ben Arfa a more responsible player

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  40. MDS….”So that’s to say your source has never benn right”….yep, that about sums him up….law of probability says he’s due one though and I reckon this may be the one 😯

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  41. I Think i Wanna follow Swans this year:-)
    My favorite Danish player Michael Laudrup is their new manager..

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  42. I see Arsenal are now favorote to sign Yann m’vila . Hopefully if they sign him that’s one team we can cross off the list from poaching mr T. 😉

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  43. Afternoon Everyone,

    I agree with Toonsy on this one, the players we are interested now are different to those we have signed in the last 2 years. We could sign the likes of Tiote and Cabaye ‘on the cheap’ because nobody really knew about them so the media interest wasn’t there as much, meaning the price isn’t driven up that way. That’s not to say they are less able players.
    The reality is that we were offer £25m for Carroll to begin with and eventually drove Lpool up to £35m. We few clubs settle for the first offer, so it comes as no great surprise that these deals arent done yet. I’ve said it before, it does worry me alittle how low our initial bids have been for players we are supposedly interested in, but these players haven’t moved elsewhere yet so still game on.

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  44. Good subject and points made.

    However we have always had that problem.

    Clubs have always hiked the prices up when we’ve approached them.

    The old policy was that the Toon would just end up paying over the odds.

    The current owners will have valued each player and won’t go over the odds.

    I can’t see it changing and the selling clubs will have accept it or lose out.

    It happened last transfer window .

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  45. Troy @60 Spot on ,it seems to be taking a while for the penny to drop with rival clubs that we ain’t the same animal as previously. 😉

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  46. Wellington… Going off that logic shouldn’t it have been written the first time NUFC had an offer rejected back in the year dot then?

    Newcastle do their transfer business the same way as most if not all clubs do theirs, low bid which is generally rejected, followed by a higher offer or moving onto the next target. In this respect we do nothing new, it’s not an “Ashley era” thing, the only thing he does different is that he’ll only go as high as what he values the player at and not the value the selling club values him, which differs from life under Shepherd who would pay more than a player was worth.

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  47. Richie, my professional training is in logic, so: one might go back to the first time NUFC had an offer rejected, only to obtain the player in the next transfer window, and find that player a success! But then, that might not be under the current scouting regime, so it wouldn’t serve as a good counter-example to the notion that we’ve been “found out” because a few initial offers have been rejected.

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  48. Wellington…If we’re dealing in logic then that’s me out 😉
    Personally I don’t think we’ve been “found out”, nothings different from the way it’s ever been other than Ashley will go up to his valuation and not the selling clubs which can be a good thing, however sometimes his valuation can possibly be too low, sometimes you have to pay quality prices for quality players(tbf he did pay a reasonable amount for Cisse), he can’t expect Carr to keep pulling a “cheap” rabbit out of the hat.

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  49. @2. It certainly wasn’t the case with Cabaye. We got him so cheap because he had a minimum bid release clause which we met meaning Lille had no choice but to let the player talk to us.

    Anyway this is nothing new. We had the same thing with Cisse and got him in the end on our terms. We drive a hard bargain and teams know that they can’t manipulate us into paying for a player than we think he’s worth. Teams who try to push prices up run the risk of us walking away which can potentially leave them with an unhappy player who wont perform as well. Then because the player hasn’t performed as well the price actually ends up becoming lower and their will be less interest from other teams which also keeps the price lower.

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