Seriously, that is how good Demba Ba has been in the last few games!
After a slow start to the season, a slow start that the player admits to I’ll add, Ba has started show the fans at St James’ Park the form that his career stats suggest that he is capable of. This will inevitably raise the question of whether or not we’ve actually managed to replace Andy Carroll already, without the presence of that elusive second striker over the summer.
The stats show that Demba Ba has scored eight league goals in nine league games (or if you want to be more impressed it’s actually eight goals in five games, as pointed out by Richietoon). That is not a bad return for a striker and leaves Ba needing just three more goals in his next ten games for the club to equal Carroll’s Premier League haul for us last season from the same amount of games.
On the goalscoring front at least, we seem to have replaced Andy Carroll. What about the rest of the game though? Carroll was a player who could bully opposition defences with his physical approach. He’d be a constant thorn in the side of the opposing defence and would have to be watched carefully at set pieces. It’s worth noting that Joey Barton set up the majority of Carroll’s goals and that when Carroll left both his own form dipped as did the assist rate of Barton.
How does Demba Ba measure up on that front?
Very well in fact. Ba is not exactly a featherweight striker. He is only an inch shorter than Carrol and is just as strong. If anything I would say that Ba has more to his game, such as pace like we saw against Stoke on Monday.
I said from the start that bringing Ba would prove to be a great bit of business and so far that is proving to be the case. Sure there is the issue of Ba’s knee problem, but as yet there have been no signs of it making an appearance. In fact the striker has been injury free for some time now.
I guess the question I’m posing now is whether you would take Andy Carroll back at the expense of Demba Ba? I know **** well that I wouldn’t. I’m not being emotional in my judgement, as it would be easy to use that to beat the Gypo with. I’m not even using his less that sparking start to life at Liverpool as a comparison. I’m not even saying that we don’t need another striker still and I’m not even fussed about the money. What I am comparing is Andy Carroll for Newcastle and Demba Ba for Newcastle.
For me it’s Ba. He has more to his game than just being a battering ram and has the ingredients to be somewhere near a 20-goal a season striker. What are your thoughts though?
[poll id=”46″]
Nice thought provoking article
given that AC was ‘one of us’ he has a special place playing for your hometown club, but the stats show ba IS better (note I say is, as in the current) ; how much better will he (AC) be in the future is an unknown
what I would say is that the £35m is rapidly becoming a huge problem for AC .AND. for liverpool, especially KD.
I expect AC to do average this season, and then liverpool will do a torres and flog him. He doesnt fit our system of play now, and he doesnt suit liverpools.
A pity really.
chalky.toon(Quote)
Ba. Great workrate, nice pace. Good in the air. Reads the game beautifully (look at his run for his 1st goal vs Stoke) Really deft finisher. Loads more to his game than Carroll and less of a risk off the pitch. We probably did not see it at the time of his signing, but he is 1st class. If he continues this season as he started it, then he deserves the #9 shirt. 🙂
Shamrock(Quote)
Am with you Toonsy, Ba just has that little bit more hunger infront of goal and to get into the right places even if they on the line tap ins.
Ba wants to play football, Andy wants to be a professional footballer (if you get me, the money, the girls, the big market on a Saturday night all that stuff)
I’ll be the first to put up ma hand when we bought him a thought Ba 😥 now am sayin Ba
HebburnMag(Quote)
Simple to me, Ba seems to have more to his game so I went for him. Still early days like, but such a promising start to his career here.
I Love Mike(Quote)
AC is the next Peter Crouch
Premandup(Quote)
No contest. Demba ba ba ba ba hands down.
Carroll’s welcome back if he crawls on all fours from Liverpool to Newcastle, he can be the backup.
Thad(Quote)
Ba and 35Million > Andy Carroll
I know we didnt see the money, but if it means Ashley is repaying his loans to the club and we may see investment in the future that’s fine with me.
I’m still torn, Ba has done very well for us, but I really rated Carroll. Not sure he will come good at Liverpool but I still think his potential is unreal, there were times here where he was just unplayable against,
SolanosTrumpet(Quote)
it will be interesting to see how we”l be able to keep Ben Arfa and the Jan striker (Maiga?) happy when Ba and Best have been on decent form
The Hig!(Quote)
Troy Stavers
1 min ago
I’ve managed to get the tortoise revived and back in it’s shell the right way round!
Does anyone know how to tell the difference between a tortoise and a turtle?
I’ve put him in the bath to test him but he just sunk. There’s bubbles coung from his nose.
But I suppose a turtle will do the same. I will give him 5 mins to do a proper test. Standby for the results. 😯
Troy Stavers(Quote)
The thing is for our three musketeers last season was that they all just seemed to suit each others game perfectly. Barton/Nolan/Carroll weren’t half the player without the others. When one or more didn’t turn up we didnt have a chance of winning.
Who do people see as our top performer this season? Really difficult but I think Jonas.
SolanosTrumpet(Quote)
Just glad that Ac is at Liverpool rather than Stoke. KD does not have a clue on how to use him, or Carroll cannot do what KD wants from him – I don’t know but something is wrong there. Pullis would have AC bombing in on goal & being a menance.
Ba has one ability that AC does not have. Ba can go from 0 to 60 in half a step. This allows him to lay back & be a truly attacking menace when the ball comes in. Ba. like Carroll is subject to injury, so that is a wash. Ba does not seem to have the need for wild night life that AC doers, or Ba handles it in a quieter way – I don’t know.
BeeGuy(Quote)
@5
wouldnt go that far Andy Carroll is a good player (Not worth 35 million though). The fact Liverpool have better players than we did when he was here means he dosnt shine as much there other people are getting all the headlines. All the Loiverpool ames ive seen this season with him and Suarez upfront it looks like they dont really get on or maybe just have a really bad understanding of each other.
All this talk of Lionel Messi being amazing – when he gets a hatrick at Stoke away I’ll believe it!! Demba Ba is the man 😀
N.Irish Toon(Quote)
dont see the point in us being linked or getting these african players if they arent going to be here for most of january. still if we got one of either maiga,sow or cisse, then surely we could get this de jong or another european player aswell so we arent just left with best and shola.
Super Marv(Quote)
Haven’t read the article… just the title… but my answer is neither.
Shola 😉
I’ll read it now
nobby(Quote)
The stats may show Ba to have the best record, but don’t forget he is playing in a far better team, I am delighted with Ba he is doing a superb job and I do feel that we have one of the best strikers in the league, however the question was what they have done for us, and as well as Ba has done Carroll before his injury was unplayable, if he could come back to that standard then I would choose Andy, but Ba is showing why Stoke were prepared to pay £9m for him before the medical, he is a class act and I see no reason why he can’t continue to do what he is currently doing, a tough call but Andy gets it from me
Patchty1(Quote)
@ Troy
😆 😆 😆
N.Irish Toon(Quote)
Carroll blew his chance at being a club legend (shouldn’t have listened to Nolan’s advice). His confidence is shot and ‘pool aren’t playing with him in mind. If, for whatever reason, we brought him back I don’t think he would fit in our system anymore as we play along the ground a lot more than last season and don’t rely on Barton set-pieces….so I don’t think AC would be a success even if he did come back.
Ba is the antithesis of that, came to the club with confidence (not fitness, mind) and hasn’t looked back.
P.S. @PREMANDUP – I can see AC becoming the next Crouch…good call
Jimal Fikzit(Quote)
Ok I’ve read it and voted Ba 😎 …… Bit 1 dimesional is carroll!
nobby(Quote)
A tougher call would be, who if we could only have one between Cabaye and Tiote, its to easy to forget the good that they done after they have left so Ba was always going to win, with both Cabaye and Tiote still here that would be a very tough call.
Patchty1(Quote)
Although to be fair Stoke with a fit Carroll would have been a different beast to with Crouch was.
Premandup(Quote)
…..”Ba’s knee problem, but as yet there have been no signs of it making an appearance. In fact the striker has been injury free for some time now.”
Doh!
Troy@9, turtles are exactly the same as tortoises, the only difference being their musical preferences. Turtles tend to go for late 1960s Psychedelic Folk Rock, whereas tortoises love Neo-classical metal and Grindcore.
I think you may have dropped a ******* with your tortoise rejuvenation process though. It’s all well and good giving them a bit of a spring clean every year to slow down the aging process, but you need to soak them in red diesel overnight before shell re-insertion. This helps to re-aerate their scales. That’ll be why it sank. Easy mistake to make anyway.
Rodzilla(Quote)
Also Troy, like snails they slow down without their shells, get a bit sluggish.
Premandup(Quote)
The big diffrence between Ba & Carroll is Carroll is still learning, where BA has been about a bit and has a bit more up top.
Carroll never was the sharpest tool in the shed as his many nights out on the town showed.
Carroll managed in the right way and taken under a wing could go on to be a fantastic player, but Liverpool don’t seem to be doing that and he doesn’t seem to be adapting to the way the team play. He doesn’t suit the game and is effectivly going to waste down there.
I’d have him back cause he isn’t a bad player who can always be a threat around the box but he would need to change his game to suit the team, but would need to change his ways as well.
Until then let him enjoy his £80K a week and rotting on the bench
GeoffM(Quote)
if AC is going to improve atall is not gonna be under Daglish, i remember how he brought our good team back to a midtable rubish team. carrol should come back home to pair BA in the attack.
gbolly(Quote)
going of subject here any thoughts for the everton game there a decent team and are gonna make it hard for us any thoughts on the line up or tactics? oh and i would pick ba
dave(Quote)
That’s a bit cruel on Crouch.
Seriously, though – it’s hard to compare as Judas popped up with some very un-strikerish qualities. His knock-downs and ability to bash three colours out of three defenders at a time were very (dare I say it) Big Al at times, and his defending could be excellent.
There are two problems that the bindippers didn’t cotton on to, though:
1. He was ***** at scoring without Nolan, and vice versa.
2. He just has no passion for any other shirt than the black and white. That much is obvious.
I wouldn’t have him back in place of Ba. No way. But as well as? Yeah, probably. Ish.
Whumpie(Quote)
I don’t support Newcastle or Liverpool. But, I don’t believe any of you were happy when Pardew came or when he signed Ba so it seems a bit hypocritical to now claim you think he’s better than Carroll.
When you’ve played Man u, Man C and Chelsea this month you’ll have a better idea of how good he is.
If he has a decent season he’ll ask for a move at the end of it anyway.
andy(Quote)
andy
November 2, 2011 at 15:33
“I don’t support Newcastle or Liverpool.”
Well keep your ******* beak out then. 😆
Toon Chicken(Quote)
Troy, fella – you crack me up. Talking of which; the shell may be cracked; which would cause him to sink. Especially if his air bag is broken.
Whumpie(Quote)
I’ve pulled the tortoise out the bath cos I thought he was playing funny buggers by holding his breath and not blowing bubbles.
He’s pretending to be asleep now! 😯
Carroll is still a crackin player and if given a run he will get goals. I still wish he was a Toon player.
Ba is looking a quality striker though and let’s hope his injury problems are behind him.
Troy Stavers(Quote)
NUFC FINISH 4TH THIS YEAR
dave(Quote)
Judas can rot, I only support the players who play for NUFC.
I’m very surprised by Ba, he seems very clinical and Judas is pretty much a one trick pony. I’m still gutted we sold him with him being a local boy, but I wouldn’t have him back. Ba gets my vote simply because he isn’t such a **** with his drinking and all that.
Despite my uproar at the time of his sale, I’m obviously over the moon at how things are going and willing to eat humble pie and say it was the right decision. £35 million!!
NorthernPaul(Quote)
Much better than Carroll that’s for sure. Could Carroll have reached a similar level with ground game by 27? I’d think with consistent first team action and training and refraining from bottling women I think he could. Can’t see him ever reaching that at liverpool now though.
Ba definitely has more to his game and now we don’t resort to hoof, only use it when necessary, woo!
Newkie(Quote)
I’ve just bought an outboard motor for my dinghy but I don’t know how to attach it. The dinghy was fairly cheap from Whitley Bay.
I took it on the Tyne yesterday and had to hold onto it with both hands but it’s hard to keep your balance whilst holding it as it’s very heavy.
Any ideas? 😯
Troy Stavers(Quote)
@Troy Stavers
I’d use 9inch nail m8, should work a treat. brst fix it while youre in the tyne. 😀
mark(Quote)
Troy – tie one end of a length of rope around the motor and the other around your ankle. That way if you do drop it you’ll be able to pull it back in.
Oh, and make sure you fill your pockets with lead, it really helps with buoyancy. 😆
Toon Chicken(Quote)
@mark
9 inch nails? Wow I’ve never heard of them 😯
You still clinging onto the life ring I threw you before? I will wait til you are safe before i try your suggestion. 😛
Should the dinghy not have a fixing board or summit? 😯
Bloody hard work steering it when holding it with both hands and keeping your balance. 😯
Troy Stavers(Quote)
Ba for me all day. I though Carroll was great but is a one trick pony as L’pool have found out, hence his gmaes played.
Can’t believe we got him for nowt. he must be worth 10mill now.
Remember when Cardone scored a few beginning of a season and Spurs were sniffing lol he was pap..
mark(Quote)
@TC
I think there’s a tinge of sarcasm in your response. But they are two good suggestions lads. 😛
I’m busy glueing a sheet of plywood to the back of the dinghy to see if that works. You would think for £9.99 the dinghy would have come with a board inserted. The bloody outboard motor cost £1500. 😯
Troy Stavers(Quote)
Why don’t you ask west ham fans about Ba before bleating…
SuaRed(Quote)
9 inch nails, did a class tune with jonny cash, one of my favs.
I got out ages ago m8, u fu**ed off, someone with a heart helped me out 🙂
I wouldnt use an engine anyway in the tyne its hard to motor thu bricks and bodies etc, was fishing there last thursday night with a few pals, caught nixy al neet, they should just concrete the ****** up.
mark(Quote)
Suared….they rate him, so your point is?
richietoon(Quote)
why dont you get a mannequin to hold onto it while u steer. put some nice clobber on her, little hotpants and that 😯
mark(Quote)
lol a £10 dingy from Argos wont hold an engine.. actually aye m8 it will be ideal. giz a shout for your maiden voyage, i’ll come and cam it..
mark(Quote)
I think we’ve got a bit of a skewed memory of Carroll’s play. He was anything but a one-trick pony. For a start, he has a thunderbolt left foot from distance and is as good a header of the ball as you’ll find (as Big Al once opined.)
But outside of that he was a good defender and would give his all to win the ball back.
So far, for the bindippers, he’s had none of those. When you’re a man of small brain, the heart is all, and his heart is black and white.
And yes, I’m really enjoying watching him fail. Perhaps Pards can get him on loan if we pay a third of his wages? 😛
Whumpie(Quote)
It’s early days yet and we don’t know if Ba’s knees will hold up but I chose Ba as well. Good with head and feet, as with Carroll but a better all round player. I agree with those that say Dalglish won’t get the best out of Carroll and let’s hope he doesn’t end up with Stoke. Defensively I think Carroll was slightly better at meeting crosses, but he also has his off-field problems. Would love to see an attacking CM brought in and centre back cover. Will Hatem get enough playing time to suit him? Somehow we need to get him into the team and give him a run of games or he may start to lose interest.
GeordieTwo(Quote)
@mark
Was that you fishing off the quayside next to the copthorne hotel with your bamboo cane and clothes line? 😯
Last I saw you had caught a welly. 😯
**** ! My bramble bush Colo hairpiece has stuck to the dinghy! I feel such a fool now! 😳
😯
Troy Stavers(Quote)
yes Whumpie, one trick pony is a little harsh. but as I said I did love carroll and was gutted when he left, for ages actually.
What I meant was to play to his strengths you have to lob balls to him similar to how we used nolan + carroll to get quite a few goals. With Ba we can still lump the ball but have other options as he’s quiker and more mobile than carroll.
mark(Quote)
At the minute obviously Ba, but considering Ba is 26 and Carroll is 22, Carroll will become a better player than Ba – there’s no getting away from that. Personally I think Demba will score more goals than Carroll this season simply because Daglish won’t play Carroll every game, he doesn’t have to really whereas Ba will play every game in the league for us if he’s fit.
AndrewNUFC(Quote)
@troy lol
No m8, I was on the gateshead side with a broomshank and a belt with a drawing pin stuck to the end. Didnt even reach the water, hence the no-fish.
Last time I saw a welly was when wor lass gave birth 🙂
mark(Quote)
Geordietwo – an attacking CM? Cabaye, Guthrie, Benny, Vukic and Gosling aren’t enough to be going on with for one position?
CB for me and we’re pretty much set. Looks like Santon can cover both full-back places, with Fergie another option. Another striker has to still be on the needs list, but at the expense of one of our current ones; probably Loven or Shola. Trouble is, a new, top-end striker is likely to cost more than both combined. 🙁
Whumpie(Quote)
Assuming Lovekrands and Ranger both leave this summer does that mean that we can bring in 2 new strikers ?
Premandup(Quote)
Ba’s movement is on another level to Carroll’s who’s rather static in the box.
Movement is what separates the good from the best though.
Ba hands down, can do it all!!! And he’s played more games than Carroll in the past 12mnths!
toonarmy87(Quote)
PREMANDUP @52
I expect Maiga to sign in January, so suppose Lovenkrands and Ranger do leave;
Ba, Maiga, Best and Shola.
I think that would be enough.
AndrewNUFC(Quote)
Ba with a clean medical record is easily a 15-20mill striker IMO
toonarmy87(Quote)
Carrol would be useful in january during the ACN. Who reckons cheeky £10m bid with simpson, and ranger part of it.
scotttoon(Quote)
I think carrolls a better player but i voted for ba because i don’t think AC would fit with pardews new style.Ba’s a better goalscorer but carroll has more to his game.
Rorycn (Bottoms up)(Quote)
For you troy.
http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?q=tortoise+no+shell&um=1&hl=en&safe=off&client=firefox-a&sa=N&rls=org.mozilla:en-GB:official&biw=1366&bih=521&tbm=isch&tbnid=P3t61tmKTrzTmM:&imgrefurl=http://www.mylot.com/w/image/2340981.aspx&docid=ghIxeeJjgWXRbM&imgurl=http://images.mylot.com/userImages/images/postphotos/2340981.jpg&w=494&h=370&ei=vHKxTs7MFozE8QOzwoyjAQ&zoom=1&iact=hc&vpx=324&vpy=186&dur=496&hovh=194&hovw=259&tx=187&ty=123&sig=114654051070688157280&page=1&tbnh=135&tbnw=224&start=0&ndsp=13&ved=1t:429,r:1,s:0
Rorycn (Bottoms up)(Quote)
AndrewNUFC
Having those 4 as strikers/back-ups would be beast (Shola on his day IS like a solid Drogba). ❗
scotttoon(Quote)
no idea why but it wont let me vote?? joys of modern tech !!
ice pup(Quote)
Mark – yep, fair enough really. Although Carroll did score with his head a lot, you can’t discount that left boot of his; he hit some crackers. Ba’s strength seems to be an incredible ability to be in the right place at the right time.
Frankly, whatever works.
Whumpie(Quote)
Premandup – nope, no way. Ranger and Loven between them are probably on a lot less than they’d have to pay a single, top-end striker. But we’ve seen what the club can do, so I do expect to see a pretty good striker arrive without it putting the balance books out of whack.
Still not sure about Maida, though – he’s come across as a bit of a ****, frankly.
Whumpie(Quote)
Agree with those who say we underappreciate carroll how good Carroll was before he left. Unstoppable on his day. But for for 35M? A complete laugher. We rebuilt half our squad with quality by spending half that.
Still need a striker in though. Best seems to me to be better as a foil rather than they main man, and he does it well. But if Ba goes down…trouble.
MDS(Quote)
Wumpie Smiths off the books this year as well
Premandup(Quote)
Both strikers have shown great potential although we are yet to see Carroll shine for Liverpool and I think that will be the determining factor. I thin Ba has more more versatile attributes which should give him the edge in this debate. Carroll has height and strength. Demba Ba has speed, reads the game and a deft touch. is in the right place at the right time.
Michael12(Quote)
Would have loved a partnership of Ba and Carroll, but the greasy pikey kent can ferk himself now.
Rotting at Loserpoo, the lad needs regular games and service to his feet. Waste of £35m, waste of talent.
Shearers Receeding Hairline(Quote)
funny how things turn around over a few month, when we were in for ba in the summer , i think 90% of fans did,nt want him (oh his knee will explode) i was delighted to see him signed, he was scoring goals for fun even when westham could,nt string a pass together and their morale was down, thats what you need in a good striker, i could understand stoke not signing him if they thought there was a problem coz they had to pay 9 mill for him, i think pardew done well to get him through his west ham connections, theres a lot more to come from him yet and we,re just starting to see his pace lately as he lacked it during ramadam etc
stephen1971(Quote)
Troy , you need one tortoise to hold from the top and one turtle to hold from under the dinghy 💡
You will have to bring the tortoise back from the other astral plain as obviously he has projected himself to the plain of ghosts and mirrors (they all do that when they spend too long in the water its some kind of defence mechanism cos they cant swim).
Anyhoo i digress, Ba for me just cos he seems to want it more and seems to have more to prove, he also has pace ability and strength (as does Judas) but Ba seems to have a better reading of the game and a less selfish streak.
Andy and Ba would (I think) be an excellent pairing but of the two I would have Ba in my team before Judas, especially with the squad we have and the style of football were playing.
❓
Shnurgmeister(Quote)
I am very impressed with Ba he has pace holds the ball up scores lots of goals and i think your right toonsey could probably be a 20 goal striker , but we are football fans not sharholders the fact is we could have Ba and Carroll at no extra cost , the club got them both for free !
Selling 22 year olds with lots of skill and even more potential is not good for any club and definatlly not good when none of the money goes back into the team .They are both good players and i want as many good players in my team as possible.
Ill say again i want both players not to choose but if i had to choose then it would be Carroll he is younger a gateshead lad can hold the ball up score from in and outside the box wouldent miss upto 9 games in jan and feb for the african cup of nations and is hard as nails . 🙂
keith(Quote)
I think Keith makes a very good point. Keeping Carroll and partnering him with Ba could have been a dream partnership reminiscent of Shearer and Ferdinand days. However the club were very keen to sell Carroll, and the player himself was more than happy to go.
For me Carroll
Sirhc(Quote)
sirhc@70 cheers , i bet he would be just as keen to come back after having dogleash as his manager for a few months 😉
keith(Quote)
I think Andy played an extra 20% better when playing for NUFC. The corwd would cheer his as the next big thing every match. He never got any stick if he had a bad game because we all thought he was the next big thing and he was going no where. He costs us nothing so we were not about to turn on the kids who came up through the acadamy. He had a charmed life.
We wanted 35 mill and he wanted 80gs a week so off he went. He is no longer a home town hero, he is a very expensive risk and any more long term injuries will immediatly pile the pressure on him.
Charlietoon(Quote)
rather have a player called ba, than one who wants to be in one every night !!!!
mg man(Quote)
and another thing is that demba ba isnt in it for the money. andy carrol clearly is as proven when piverpool came calling. we dont need no players who only play for money. we want players who want to play for newcastle and it should stay like that
LUKE(Quote)
Andy carrol aint doing well at liverpool cause they dint swing high balls into the box enough,its mainly to feet thats why hes struggling.Ba v carrol got to be ba for me stats dont lie
TOONARMYELITE(Quote)